Re: [personal-clouds] [projectvrm] Cookie Doom Already Appearing in Data | ComScore Shames Ad Clutterers | Global Adspend in Doldrums as Dog Bites Man - MarketingVOX

[Johannes Ernst < >]

Just for the record, the idea for the personal clouds list and the 
personal-clouds.org site was mine. I can provide a history if you would like 
me to but I'd rather get back to the substantive discussions instead of 
speculating whose motives are which and which aren't.

E.g. recent discussions on the personal clouds list on backup protocols, how 
to automate one's front door and house energy savings do not belong on a VRM 
list, just like a discussion on how retailers can take advantage of empowered 
customers does not belong on the personal clouds list. Most of the 
subscribers on either list would unsubscribe or tune out, and that would 
serve nobody and no cause. It's simply different communities with different 
aims. Yes, there's overlap, but that's how it is with communities and with so 
many other things. And I think we are all used to being subscribed to dozens 
of mailing lists anyway.


On Apr 11, 2013, at 14:15, Mary Hodder 
<
 >
 wrote:

> Hi Dennis,
> 
> I think what is really going on is that the VRM list is very active and 
> well moderated. Kaliya wants her own list.. to make PDEC more relevant.
> But all the PDEC people are on VRM and regular posts.
> 
> Those people know the knowledge base is at VRM.. so they all cross post.
> 
> It's just annoying to have all that time taken.. just because someone got 
> to the party late and didn't cultivate community. So everyone should just 
> waste
> time.. I find it annoying.
> 
> Let's send to one list or another.. and stop trying to make everything be 
> on two lists.. or most everything.  What I'm seeing are some Personal Cloud 
> email then forwarded to the VRM list.. people posters don't want to miss 
> out on the audience.
> 
> mary
> 
> On Apr 11, 2013, at 4:10 PM, Mary Hodder wrote:
> 
>> Dennis,
>> 
>> The project VRM list:  Project VRM 
>> <
 >
>> 
>> -  has about 700+ people on it.. and it's been around for 7 years, working 
>> on development of VRM, personal data, cloud, personal data store, privacy 
>> and personal data ecosystem topics
>> 
>> The personal-clouds list: 
>> 
>> - has about 70 people, many of whom are on the VRM list.. and has been 
>> around for 3 months.. taking about personal data and clouds, privacy, 
>> personal data ecosystem, etc.
>> 
>> Most of the heavy posters are on both lists.. which is why are seeing so 
>> much overlap.
>> 
>> If someone posts to both lists, and I want to reply, I get a total of 6 
>> email (including the two bounces because I manage my gmail lists 
>> differently than other lists) and have to send 2 times.. all of which 
>> takes up about 5-8 minutes of time, depending on what the situation is.
>> 
>> It's annoying.. it would be nice if we could get on one list and stop 
>> this.. because for us on both, it's happening a lot.
>> 
>> Mary
>> 
>> 
>> On Apr 11, 2013, at 2:02 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
>> 
>>> As a subscriber to only one of the lists, it is difficult to see the 
>>> problem that Mary has.
>>> 
>>> I haven't seen that much cross-posting on [personal-clouds].  I usually 
>>> do not continue cross-postings in replies I make. Since I don't know what 
>>> another list's conversation is, I don't cross-post back because I have no 
>>> context and I don't want to spam the other conversation.  That means I 
>>> contribute to the problem of cross-postings ending up in forked, 
>>> uncoordinated conversations.
>>> 
>>> It seems to me that those who cross-post are the only ones who can assess 
>>> whether the possible forking and off-topic cross-rejoinders are good 
>>> reasons not to cross-post in the first place.
>>> 
>>> - Dennis
>>> 
>>> PS: I also have no idea how and why this list was created, but it is 
>>> closer to my personal interests than the overall VRM topic.  I don't 
>>> think personal clouds are a subset of VRM, although they may be material 
>>> to VRM.
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: 
>>> 
 
>>>  
>>> [mailto:
 ]
>>>  On Behalf Of Mary Hodder
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2013 10:14
>>> To: 
>>> 
 
>>> Cc: Project VRM
>>> Subject: Re: [personal-clouds] [projectvrm] Cookie Doom Already Appearing 
>>> in Data | ComScore Shames Ad Clutterers | Global Adspend in Doldrums as 
>>> Dog Bites Man - MarketingVOX
>>> 
>>> Can I ask, why are we doing this.. with two e-mail list addresses?
>>> 
>>> We talk about exactly the same things on both lists..
>>> and Clouds are a subset of the VRM topic
>>> and for me, I have two different email addresses that work for the 
>>> lists.. so I can't even reply-all
>>> and it's annoying to get TWO email.. for each post
>>> 
>>> So.. I ask, why are we doing this.. with two lists.
>>> 
>>> Why can't we just use the list with more people on it (VRM -- as it's 
>>> been around for 7 years)
>>> and get one email per thread?
>>> 
>>> mary
>>> 
>>> [ ... ]
>>> 
>> 
>