Session Start: Tue Aug 24 11:54:46 1999 * Logging Status Window to '#icann-santiago-chat-082499.log' #ICANN-Santiago logbot baptista mlangston Richard @wbbot #ICANN-Santiago End of /NAMES list. Session Start: Tue Aug 24 12:32:08 1999 * Logging #ICANN-Santiago to '#icann-santiago-chat-082499.log' *** andyg has joined #ICANN-Santiago *** andyg has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer) *** andyg (andyg@stgo017.dialup.reuna.cl) Quit (Connection reset by peer) see you soon *** baptista has quit IRC (QUIT: Leaving) *** baptista (baptista@cgowave-40-147.cgocable.net) Quit (QUIT: Leaving) *** edelman has joined #ICANN-Santiago mark, pls try accessing the realserver at pnm://200.28.16.28/live/test.rm. should get just static -- that's all the signal is right now. but http delivery should work ok. ben, I will try as well from my end can you generate some noise? just static at the moment, i think. but let me try to find a mic. if you can get in at all, then it works ok. this test is really for the benefit of mark... who is behind a firewall and therfore has trouble with some realservers. ok, although I am curious about the sound quality sorry. still getting the "file not found using http" error. ok, let me try something else now. just verified that I am able to get the archives from cyber.law.harvard.edu/icann/events, so I'm working. (sorry for the delay, I had to help a user with a problem.) pls try again, now, on the same url. same error. you know anything about realserver admin? i followed instructions at http://service.real.com/firewall/adminrs.html#firewall and it was OK. (ok in the sense tha their instructions made sense and i could do what they said.) hm. not really, no. let me have a look. can you go back to the way it was the first time you asked me to try it? ben, you have some tunes playing now/ i hvaen't done anything that could possible mess it up all tha tmuch. if it worked before, it will still work now. yes, music hey! Got it! what was the trick? it's working now. getting some background noise, and music. *laugh* you tell me, Ben. I didn't even glare at it differently. :) but it's working well! a thousand thanks. I owe you a beer or something. well, i don't know. you will want the "Berkman Center video hosted from Santiago" link. get in early becuase that's only capacity 25 and will perhaps fill up, though the santiago locals have lots of licenses so mayb enot. no beer. i'm underage. and all part of the job. *laugh* ok. warning: you still need to go through the login system, of course... test.rm is *NOT* the real URL! the link from the Berkman web page? Who's the music, by the way? Kinda catchy. I was going to ask the same question good. I've got an audio feed, and logging of this chat session's working. hey, the charlie brown song... *** mark-L2 has joined #ICANN-Santiago hm. *** mlangston has quit IRC (QUIT: Leaving) *** mlangston (skritch@24.1.127.44) Quit (QUIT: Leaving) grr. of course, I get everything working, and the proxy server dies. :) oops I just love MAE-West. I just love Netcom. You'd think, being within walking distance of the national backbone, I'd have a decent connection. You'd be wrong. :) Thankfully, the company I'm at has an east-coast proxy as well. Mark you work at an ISP? I knew I should've added that proxy to my home firewall. *sigh* Richard: Nope. I'm a UNIX consultant. aha the company I'm currently contracted to is a fair bit picky about securing their networks, which of course means that I run into problems like this a lot. (not that I'm complaining, it's probably the first company I've worked for that had a decent security policy.) hm. The proxy outages don't usually last this long, tho. ben may have stopped the test to get ready to go live oh, no. It's definitely the proxy. All west-coast outbound traffic's dead. you don't use the proxy for irc? Can't connect to my home boxes, can't use the web proxy, etc. I do, but I connect to a remote machine through the proxy, then IRC from there. It's usually one of the Suns I've got at home, but I've got that locked down very tightly, and I can't get into it via our east coast proxy, so I'm currently conencted via another account I maintain with a private ISP co-op. yes, i stopped the text. test, that is. but I've still got IRC and audio feeds after a quick scramble, so now I'm just missing my private email. I think I can survive a few hours without that. :) ben, will there be a link updated on the berkman page? or the www.reuna.cl page? *** mark-L2 is now known as mlangston PING? PONG! two minutes got video, sound is low sound is good I don't even see the link from the berkman page.... 2 minutes, please *** baptista has joined #ICANN-Santiago *** PickANickName has joined #ICANN-Santiago *** PickANickName has quit IRC (QUIT: See_you!) *** PickANickName (PickANickN@cgowave-40-147.cgocable.net) Quit (QUIT: See_you!) mark, the link from www.reuna.cl/icann/icann_live.html is good there's no active link there for the DNSO meeting. yes, but that's not remote participation. besides, I need what Ben's setting up. don't worry, room is empty still. will be starting late. is this the ISP constituency meeting live? no, this is dnso ga. oops sorry *** andyg has joined #ICANN-Santiago got audio, video. *** BretFausett has joined #ICANN-Santiago * BretFausett is a computer geek :-) is there a link for the video / audio yet Andy reporting in, from font row, left, ICANN Santiago *** NickPatience has joined #ICANN-Santiago realaudio is up and running yep. working well. Yes, follow the "now in progress link" from http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/icann/sant and all the peoples entering now... it's a small link off the berkman icann/santiago page, near the top. found it Ben: I assume the static in the audio's just an artifact of my use of http instead of udp... ben's away from his PC right now ah. i am here now. static ... will check. fyi to all: meeting looks like it won't start for another ~10 minutes It's not a huge issue. More of an annoyance. Do the live participants have to listen to the music too? good. Time for me to visit the soda machine. :) *** Dschutt has joined #ICANN-Santiago *** MichaelFroomkin has joined #ICANN-Santiago *** alphaque has joined #ICANN-Santiago *** JohnReynolds has joined #ICANN-Santiago Yes. THe music is nice relaxing background music, considering many people here are still in the mist of jetlag *** Richard is now known as RichardLindsay *** JohnReynolds has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** JohnReynolds (JohnReynol@net-76-218.tuc.com) Quit (QUIT: ) *** paulds has joined #ICANN-Santiago yes, we have music too Ben, can the chair see the IRC screen? feh. our voicemail system's down, and the pop machine just took my money. Looks like today is the day for things to break. I'm sure it sounds better live. Sounds like a distant am radio station from here. same here. richard: participants may not see all messages on irc I'm right in front of a monitor speaker here, and the quality is excellent. so we on irc just comment amongst ourselves? excellent sound on voice. who's chairing? Is that Nii? yes ok. It's nice to put faces to names. richard: no, apparently some comments on irc may make it to the meeting *** EdmonChung has joined #ICANN-Santiago I just lost sound... yes, voice is excellent even here in malaysia Sounds like Roberts Rules. very much so. :) bret: what are roberts rules ? Let's hope it stays roberts rules throughout what's the question? (that Nii asked)? is he speaking spanish ? yes. I think. Someone's talking on top of Amadeau. who is testing? who the heck keeps interrupting the audio? *** EdmonChung has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** EdmonChung (EdmonChung@HSE-TOR-ppp24825.sympatico.ca) Quit (QUIT: ) Are you getting the English translator's audio as well? that must've been the translator sure sounded garbled Dennis Jennings on the mike First was Amadeu *** EdmonChung has joined #ICANN-Santiago input on what? electing a GA chair. ben: I'm confused about the "topic" part of the remote commenting page. It says one per person per topic. Is that per those pull-down topics? Because there's no topics that relate to the GA meeting underway as such. maybe this is BOD update can anyone see what's on the slide presentation ? not me. nope pretty pointless for them to be putting screen shots of the scribe notes out over RealVideo. Totally unreadable. I can barely make out a letter or two. this is the scribe's screen agreed. screen is not readable via realvideo is the task force on funding comprised only of Board members or did they appoint others as well? ben, anything we can do about the scribe's screeen? shouldn't all participants be miked? Ah. Better. * andyg is away since 2:31:40 PM - automagically set away after 10 min idling. Msglog [ON] why? * andyg is back There's only a couple of Mikes that have to be rushed around the room by a couple of _very_ lovely young ladies, so I, for one, am not complaining! heh. Why would it cost up to US$1 mil to set up the at-large membership? heh. why the bloody hell is the names council so disorganized ? Whups. * paulds sighs. There Isn't an real NC yet? nope. er, I thought there was one... still provisional. yes, true not a _real_ one *chuckle* ...and the ranks divide. Joop has a 5 minute talk planned oh, great. How can the business people participate in e-mail WGs without e-mail. Brilliant, Javier. ahh, joop. finally, a face to an email address ! *** mason has joined #ICANN-Santiago Did Javier really just say that basically the business constituency was going to have its won WGs? I have to go and get ready to run Joop's power point presentation. back soon whois the chair Nii Quaynar That's Nii Quaynor chairing. those would be the IP constituency observers.... with what tldns.com is doing, gtld will _surely_ be the largest constituency ! ;) ...at which point their seats can expand from the 1 ICANN just reduced them to. *** mason has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer) *** mason (mason@cgowave-40-147.cgocable.net) Quit (Connection reset by peer) argh * paulds runs off to beat up a br0ke NT server... * paulds is away: (NT sux) [BX-MsgLog On] who's that? Fay Howard Ah. cute Pixellated. :) she was one of the interim ccTLD pNC reps who was that with the laptop? Andy? I'm sort of hanging around by ben Edlman and the other Berkman guys on the LH side of the stage. Blande hair, pony tail. I can wave if you want me to. *laugh* Andy: When's joop presenting? Will it be part of the constituency reports? well, i'm sort of hanging around in my shorts, at home here in malaysia. ;) not sure. tacked on the ned of the constituencies, I would say good. end, not ned * paulds is back from the dead. Gone 0 hrs 7 min 25 secs the translator is very hard to understand. are you guys getting the spanish or the english translation? english english ah. question answered garbled english yes, i can hardly hear her perhaps due to interference near computers I'm hearing english, I think. yes - very difficult completely impossible to understand, I'd say *** JonZittrain has joined #ICANN-Santiago it's very hard to hear. I haven't understood any of it. Ben, the mike on the translator needs adjustment. It's too high. english, but a very nasal woman which makes deciphering it hard to understand ! someone should take the mike out of her larynx. :) a little lower greetz jon it sounds fine out of the translation sets here. must be an audio interface problem it's heavily distorted on the feed. he's giving the IDNO support right now excellent ! It's a level problem. Hello. non-commercial report, I think. but what is he saying ? Her voice is maxing the level on the feed. when she's quiet, it's nondistorted. I wish I knew what any of that was. andy: Was that support for IDNO as a seperate constituency? and did it come off as official support from the NCDNHC? yes, but the translatr said "fora" instead of constiuency! :^( looks empty Joop had kittens hah *laugh* I'll bet! who's this? Michael Palage ah. secretary for Registrar const. "in conjunction with ICANN?" Who? In what capacity? What ICANN input? CORE? as ICANN accredited registrars *** mason has joined #ICANN-Santiago here is Joop Yep! yes ! joop's on ! aww, fiddlesticks ! congestion ! JW's trying to get Joop's powerpoint presentation online. ah. icann rejected idno again ? it wasn't rejected per se, it was ignored...unless Joop was told something we don't know about... geez Dyson said it wouldn't be considered. but she said it "unofficially" as an individual, not a BoD member. hm joop sounds tired Very. The time difference btw. NZ and CL is large. yah (I think) same as Japan... 4:00am right now yep. 7am tomorrow there. :) heh! 4? not same, similar... I assume every time Joop pauses he's waiting for a slide advance... there ya go! was that a motion for more time? yes. coulnd't hear oki 3 minutes more, I think. how is the audio quality? good. good pretty good mostly Except the translator. Yes, motion made from floor to extend time. which feeds are you using which are good? That's horrible. Check her levels. very bad traslator joop's panting. Ben: I'm on the realvideo feed from the berkman page. *** dianecabell has joined #ICANN-Santiago Joop is too kind bad connection too, i keep rebuffering. RV feed from Berkman @ santiago thanks, mark. others: which is good, which are bad. pls be specific. * andyg is away since 3:03:21 PM - automagically set away after 10 min idling. Msglog [ON] hi diane :) Yo RV G2 feed is good - I think it depends on the mike in the room yah, RV berkman feed is good Give that man a Constituency! :-) :) d'oh! Jinxed it. Slides are now up off the DNSO GA agenda page rebuffering. cool what about feeds other than ours? you like ours because it doesn't go through translator? i might be able to get others changed at the first break. I hope he gets applause. (we are at 21 streams of our feed... capacity there is 25; capacity on translated feeds is 200, so need to make that change!) where is the DNSO GAagenda page? I think there's a link from the berkman page. * paulds claps. cyber.law.harvard.edu/icann/santiago there is a dnso page, but I don't think there is a GA page * andyg is back joop was trying to read the presentation off the screen, even though we'd given him a copy of the notes half way through! Hm. There's a GA agenda somewhere...off the ICANN main page, then? pls make that change ! there'll be at least 10 ppl from malaysia requesting feeds tomorrrow *** RobinNixon has joined #ICANN-Santiago heh did anyone hear that? "bootstrap of the Cyberspace Association" :) who's speaking? *clapclapclap!* I posted this to the question page, FYI: Yow! eeek! turn her volume down, it's maxing! ga agenda is on the broadcast.asp pgae, called "agenda" linked there the feed just got significantly faster... beeen! oops, sorry. Cut and paste doesn't work. will work on audio changes, but have to scribe now, sorry guys. Bret-> I'm ready to read your comment this is Eva Frolich * paulds 's ears hurt. :/ the translator's volume on the feed's way too high. oops, this is the translator! just have her sit back from the mike or something. * alphaque wants to strangle translator Oh, this should be fun. here's Esther! Jon --> at end of first sentence, say "constituencies" rather than "constituency." Yes, you did, Esther. scarf??? Excuse, excuse, excuse... What decision? Who made it? When? In what meeting? Feh! control that spin, Esther. here it comes. We can't Esther. The MAC's closed. put some questions up on the discussion page, guys! You formed it and got the recommendations without us. no, they're proposing a new At Large Council to take over from here "Individual domain name holders should be allowed to participate in constituencies for which they qualify." The word is parity But they're deciding on the at-large formation based on "staff recommendations" tomorrow or Thursday. * paulds doesn't believe that anything but individuals *have* interests. Wow. 5 minutes of saying nothing. *** mason has quit IRC (QUIT: Leaving) *** mason (mason@cgowave-40-147.cgocable.net) Quit (QUIT: Leaving) And now her focus is drifting. I'll be teaching a class 3:25-4:30 - someone email if anything nukelike happens Dilution. ok michael Strength. *** MichaelFroomkin has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** MichaelFroomkin (MichaelFro@g382-1.law.miami.edu) Quit (QUIT: ) ooh joop with the Good Point. That's just too bad, Javier. *LAUGH* Good one, Tony. :) when, Nii? You have to make a motion to postpone or table. You can't do it unilaterally. No one answered your question Bret. hrmph Feh. snafu. PING? PONG! - This is OK--Nii is chairing, and needs to go with the sense of the mtg. (Indeed, he said he'd all for the vote later, and no one objected.) So long as the vote is put, I'm not troubled. don't worry, we'll make sure the vote gets done!, Or Andy will give someone a wedgie on-stage what are the 5 regions ? It would be nice to have the speaker's name flashing on the video screen Dopey, Sneezy, Sleepy, Sleazy, and Doc. :) north america, europe, south america, africa and asia ? NA, SA, EU, AF and Pan-Asia Jonathan Cohen, IP Constituency, and on the board of the ca TLD, I belive isn't that a conflict of interest? Or is it? How many members does the IP constituency currently have? oooo, all names council members would actually have been trained by this constituency ? ;) The IPC strongly wrote it. not sure, but there's a gaggle of IP lawyers sharking around the place big surprise Is that because the expressed concerns haven't already made it into the draft? you know what all of this comes down to? 7 groups going, "We're going to do things our own way, screw you guys, we're going home." amadeu speaks again Do I have an "IP interest" if my interest is in reducing the influence of other IP interests? arent the pNC supposed to present ? Why does Amadeu get to speak so often? I thought speakers would be limited or something. This is only no. 2. He's just been first to the mike twice. Watch Amadeu as he tries to end-run WG-C. here we go, lads! the lighting is a bit bad Here. Do it here. if anybody's seeing this, i motion to continue with idno discussion Second! we should vote here as well Amen. yes, consensus from malaysia I vote yes. Aye. * paulds raises his virtual hand. Jon, get this communicated to them. please? Yes. im in andyg, is anyone there looking at irc ? Or someone who's in the room there? This issue should be brought up first to the Names Council I think the NC should discuss it Roll-call vote! yes, we have consensus ;) excellent ! Rough consensus which way? I missed it. *CLAPCLAPCLAPCLAP!* yay * paulds claps * alphaque joins paulds the big yes Who's this? who asked that? what was that about? rough meeting - excited people I'll second that. Is that Sondow? Oh. What "new" constituency would be proposed? hm He's trying to be sneaky. Doug ?Cohen with the IPC constutiency the IPC's trying to slip something dilatory in. Todd Cohen. the ip lawyers are firing into reactive mode right now looked smug as hell I'd be smug too if I was on a ski trip. :) i am looking at irc now Yeah, now they want a separate "copyright" or they'll call it "content provider" constituencu. Here comes all the lawyers... sorry, had it off before That's a guess. Oh, jeez. ben, can we have the IRC guys voting too! so NOW voting's important?!? oh oh I've been for that forever, and now all of a sudden things don't go their way and they want to get anal about voting. This is ludicrous. this meetings need better chairman. the current one is too soft. and who was that? Ok, I want everyone to notice something: The room's full of white male lawyers for IP concerns. i don't have a good technical solution for irc voting too. would be ovrewhelmed by all the msgs going by so fast. open to suggestions. Did he say anything? I want ICANN to argue withme again about whether these meetings are fair and representative. he questioned chairman judging consensus the chairman need not address this. There are only 15 of us. Can gauge consensus easily rather than looking for formal votes. Ben: You or someone get a quick feel for consensus here, and report it to the room. This is dilatory. The chair should move the hell on. yes - the chair should move on Nii! Move on! Been here, done that. ok, go for it next time & zittrain and i will try to report same. they are trying to bully him why are they suddenly challenging the chair ? thanks, Ben. thanks Well, we clearly see who is being obstreperous. It's the IPC again. Imagine that. :/ they don't want concensus This is obstruction, pure and simple. At least stand yer butt up when you address the room. Furrfu! He doesn't represent the copyright ommunicty...there IS not copyright community. * paulds grunts "Ugh, lawyers." and then nudges Diane and grins. 4Diane hisses hehe Can someone formally motion The ORders of the Day and move this meeting forward? you know - these people - ie the lawyers are well organized - and you guys are the fish food. you should organize too That's all you have to do. Motion for Orders of the Day, chair has to recognize it, and move on. IDNO is an attempt to organize paulds: it _has_ organized. ;) but you have to organize with fire. We are organized. We just can't afford to be there and block anything that happens. yes aww, c'mon buddy ! Which is why I keep arguing this is unfair. Look at the balance right now. Someone object! ok, ben, let's count irc votes too geez.... Jeez. I object. I vote no. you dont have to be there - time to orgaznize in private - like they do 1 NO I object. I vote no. i object NO NO. Actually, as phrased, I'd support that! were not prepaired to vote. Lets not be pigeons - i'm interested in all of your observations and comments No. It delays individual participation indefinitely *** Display has joined #ICANN-Santiago I vote this should be put to the NC first not directly to ICANN Food fight fyi: the chat is currently on a projection screen. yes ! in *addition* to the IDNO topic, sure, not instead of it. good lets wave and continue with your comments 4she slinks down in her chair the chair is wish washy. it's been put to vote twice already lawyers - their doing a good job - the chair has lost control. either way, this should be put to the Names Council before going to the ICANN boards no, let's carry on argh! the vote happened - the chair accepted - move on. stop playings footsies with the layars damn, I had to work. What happened? get a grip, mr chairman *** Display has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** Display (Display@stgo011.dialup.reuna.cl) Quit (QUIT: ) I vote no. i vote no no *** Display has joined #ICANN-Santiago *CLAPCLAPCLAP* now MOVE ON! *** baptista has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer) *** baptista (baptista@cgowave-40-147.cgocable.net) Quit (Connection reset by peer) * andyg is away since 3:40:08 PM - automagically set away after 10 min idling. Msglog [ON] yes, three times and same result each time. carry on the meeting, mr chairman I'm totally confused. I'm going to make a sandwich. 1does this whisper? * paulds abstains. diane: Use /msg username whatyouwanttosay. (assuming you're using a normal IRC client) WGs can be formed by anyone! c'mon Nii, be a hardass. plz Nii, reign it in. Now. *** Dschutt has quit IRC (Ping Timeout) *** Dschutt (David@2.specoinc.enterconnect.net) Quit (Ping Timeout) doubleclick on a name and open a separate channel. get 'im, Dennis! Is that a copy of the ICANN bylaws Dennis has in his hands? :) I think so. heh! This should be interesting. Someone motion to give them time. aww, i've lost the feed due to net congestion. what's happenning ? who was she? It's OUR meeting, it can be extended if we want it to be. *** Dschutt has joined #ICANN-Santiago That was Kleiman from the NCDNHC, I think. oki (I'm guessing, tho) * andyg is back lawyers are all concregating outside the room no I'm NOT surprised. They have to do damage control now. go bother them poke them with pointy sticks or something Go get a very long drink of water near them. the feed is patchy, cant hear a thing she's fine where I am good here too. fine feed here yeah, just got better which one you using? which feed, alphaque. comments about feeds *MUST* indicate which feed is in question. there are, what, six? alpha: Hit stop, then hit play again. Refresh the feed. cyber.law.harvard.edu Theresa Swinehart, MCI, says Bret *** RobinNixon has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer) *** RobinNixon (RobinNixon@nixon-db.dsl.clubnet.net) Quit (Connection reset by peer) thanks for the tip which link did you use to get there? me? BCIS IRC No.3 Amadeu AGAIN?!? What's he doing , sitting next to the mike? which link did you, alphaque, use to ge tthe realvideo that was giving you trouble? need to know which feed to look into. cyber.law.harvard.edu, ben he shouldn't be allowed to dominate the meeting like this. it's spotty for me, but it could be here in malaysia how long is the metg scheduled to run? until gac comes at 5:30 pm local time oh, sorry, berkman center at santiago 3 hours I belive *** baptista has joined #ICANN-Santiago thanks, alphaque. will look into it. i'll have to go soon, my battery is nearly flat and another guy is hogging the only power plug nearby keep giving 'em hell, Andy. somebody give that boy an extension cord andy, where are you? i don't kno who you are. i may have ac cord fo ryou. The other guy has a laptop, let him unplug for a while while you recharge. sorry - had to go offline - who is this gentlemen amadeu amadeu That's Amadeu. Again. He's being timed, right? very nice He's rambled for a 3 minutes. *** JoshElliott has joined #ICANN-Santiago Cut him off. nigel-s up - supports IDNO let me know when roberto is on - naked with a funny hat. hah *LAUGH* forgot about that. sorry - jeff just corrected me - naked with a colorful hat hm, IRC is about three seconds ahead of my feed. :) *clapclapclap* Geez. Randy Bush is there? Oh, come on. is jeff W here? Ghods, I hope not. just curious. *** anonymous has joined #ICANN-Santiago But then, you'd think 95k people could all cough up a dollar to put him there. :) ha *** anonymous has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** anonymous (anonymous@208.241.124.26) Quit (QUIT: ) maybe that was him. :) i'm sure there here. maybe. Yeah: Why are they such a bunch of weenies? :) whos a weenie? * paulds chuckles The NC's being distictly weenielike. oh, a break? Just a joke. Good. I can go to the bathroom. If Ben comes back, have him adjust the feed volume on the translator during the break. Jon, Ben, somebody stand in front of the camera and entertain us during the break. dont say bathroom - this may be on overhead ok chaps, it's coming to 4am here in malaysia, and i need to present to our BoD tomorrow, so gotta knock off right now. when's the next broadcast meeting ? haha which camera is on? I'm signing off too, thanks for sharing the space, follks! cya *** dianecabell has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** dianecabell (dianecabel@roam216-47.law.harvard.edu) Quit (QUIT: ) 1sec alpha... joop should talk to us - take advantage of the feed somone give joop a terminal GAC Public Forum at 7:30PM Eastern (12:30AM on August 25 *** iceblue has joined #ICANN-Santiago danf, copy/paste just br0ke dang, even August 25 Public Meeting starts at 9:00AM Eastern (2:00PM GMT). cant do the gac forum. will do the icann public meeting at 0900 25th. ICANN Board Meeting starts at 8:30AM Eastern (1:30PM GMT) August 26 August 26 DNSO Names Council meeting begins at 2:00PM Eastern (7:00PM GMT). thats all. :) iceblue - meeting adjourned for a few hours - anyone know how long nah, just 10 minutes hey, if joop's coming on irc, i'll stay a while. anybody can confirm that ? bakc at 4 something *** StevenCoates has joined #ICANN-Santiago somebody point the camera at a TV. someone try to get joop to talk to us and answer question via irc on video feed - it's open lets take advanntage a have a good old fashioned meeting is anyone there in the room non-idle? back. Mmmm. I wish I could talk someone into bringing me lunch. *** SrikanthNarra has joined #ICANN-Santiago How much longer is this meeting supposed to run? Richard... were you at that first mtg in Cambridge last fall? so how long is this break - 10 minutes? yes 10m Joe: I think so. hey, srikanth ! not able to hear much over video just joined in Hi Sri. is it better with audio feeds Sri: There's nothing going on, it's a break. hi alpaque hi mark nothing's going on, sri. it's a 10m break they should make a point of putting our comments on overhead - adds pepper to the meeting - an instant peanut gallery ok :) Andy, if you're there: Go find out what they lawyerly contingent's up to. :) i will ask joop if he can make an appearance thanx he's busy networking right now Joe: Only if I can pay someone to hurl fruit at them. :) andyg, yeah get joop if possible plant mikes on this - someone must know how to do that figgers :) alphahaque can u give a fast update on situation please hi sri! nice to see you here hi andy *** StevenCoates has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** StevenCoates (StevenCoat@dial246.gatewayone.com) Quit (QUIT: ) they've reached consensus on requesting that idno be put on the agenda tomorrow Hi Jonathan, how are the meetings progressing? bless them - atlast one good thing for a change :) Anyone have Michael Froomkin's e-mail address handy? I thought I had it, but I'm not finding it now... JOE, you think i should put the chat on the big screen? have been doing that sometimes, on and off. is that the IRC channel in that window on the projected display? lawyer types tried to derail that, calling for two additional votes to withdraw. both failed, so idno's request to be on the agenda is a yes i'm sure the lawyers are pow pow ing on that one. The cat has not been killed yet, and the chairs credibility has been destroyed - we all contributed to that. I thought I saw some window scrolling htere for a second. yes, mark, it was there for a minute or two whats next ? rest of time Paul: I have it, but I can't get to my home system right now, sorry. i'll keep looking. wanted to send him an update froomkin@law.miami.edu working group reports next paul: Check the GA archives on the DNSO website. Should be some messages in there from him. andy, got joop ? Or just use the one Sri has. ;) here it is - froomkin@law.miami.edu nah he's yakking put joop on the camera Put Joop in the chair's seat. :) what camera is on? andy: Full view of the stage, display, and podium. standby thanks sri. top right, if you're facing the stage welcome paulds how is the video signal itself? just found it myself :) looks like it's in the back left corner, if you're facing the back of the room. http://www.law.miami.edu/people/faculty/froomkin.html cute picture of michael. :) are the cuts between camera shots helpful? well-timed? on-target? ben, pathcy, but much better than before Ben: Good for faces, horrible for the scribe's screen. did you see me wave? i'm sorry, alphaque, what's much better than before? The scribe camera's worthless for the video feed. mark, are they doing video of the scribe's screen? they're not supposed to... everything is microscopy ben, yes, except for once when camera lagged on chair when consensus was being out to vote Ben: Seems like it, yes. starting up again They'll cut over to it every so often. Ditd it a lot during the BoD status report. ben, no, camera was on presentation screen where scribe's notes were shown hi i just saw someone with grey suit wave and go towards the camera on the other side Damn. I got congestion right when you waved. :) not me - I don't wear suits! ha This should be interesting. ok - keep an eye out for the lawyers. jonatahn coehn about to talk on WGA dang, work calls * paulds is away: (werkin') [BX-MsgLog On] Yep. This should be entertaining. congestion ! Wow. Just the way the WG was run! ben, got cut off, and now can't get back to the reuna english stream, is it congestion? *** EdmonChung has quit IRC (Ping Timeout) *** EdmonChung (EdmonChung@HSE-TOR-ppp24825.sympatico.ca) Quit (Ping Timeout) bye guys, sleepy. see u at icann public meeting. bye alpha! quit *** alphaque has quit IRC (QUIT: Leaving) *** alphaque (dinesh@j54.dms33.jaring.my) Quit (QUIT: Leaving) i might disappear again, only got a few minutes to boost battery power slightly dennis around ? I'll wander off and try to find a double power adapter good luck, Andy. the reuna english stream -- can someone else try it and report if it works. ok fo rme... it worked fine for a while, but now cant connect others... please, a few of you try (anyone with two computers on his/her desk?) and report back. 'cuz it's perfect for me. our realserver in santiago is at 24 streams... 1 more lucky person could get in, i would think. The "rest" of his time? heh. Ben - can't get on Ruena or Berkman video streams now, only audio. Was on Berkman video until break Be firm, Nii. hmm. ok. could be having net problems here. will check it out. who is the person who is talking now ? the gentlemean with white beard well, i still have two-way net. * paulds is back from the dead. Gone 0 hrs 7 min 40 secs eek and there are now 25 people on the portable video server. yow. The translator's still too loud. *someone* is there. i could type ips, but... help - translation booms a bit translator is possessed. sound got too much resound in it - difficutl to understand can someone type it It's impossible to understand what she's saying. Makes translation useless. could be ex kgb I'd rather guess at the spanish... Wow. Amadeu gestures a lot. a spanish thing really? i'm spanish It looks more Italian to me. same thing, but has a different accent who's that? :) who speaks? That's Randy Bush, feeling excluded. k "executive decision", hm. we did our best speech Wait a minute. How come they get to act as a constituency? They're not even tentatively recognized by the ICANN BoD yet. Not that I'm disagreeing with what she's saying, but still... * paulds shrugs. is michael around ? its all so very confusing! AMEN Preach it to 'em sister. Missed that. What'd she say? it could be windows dressing But preach it more clearly. Sri: Michael had to teach, I think. yes, should be back ~4:45 i think I'll second that. k who is the lady talking and which constituency ? That's kathy Kleiman, NCDNHC. kathryln ? k good How can ICANN lift contributory infringement liability under the relevant laws? They can't. They just don't realize that yet. in other words its half baked work we have done and we are going to get it done get it implemented In other words, "We don't care that there wasn't adequate representation, we're going to go ahead without you." are comments on screen ? He's going to head up the committee to review the work of the committee that he headed up? what happened to Michaels comments on wipo *** HilaryKarls has joined #ICANN-Santiago Hey! I didn't know Bill was going to be there. was his comments considered in wg-a ? Sri: I don't know. Andy / Ben are comments on screen ? You wait until WG-D is finished. :) comments are on screen now. who is the gentleman talking ? That's Bill Semich. thanks ben *** mason has joined #ICANN-Santiago ccTLD. ex pNC member. which country ? I forget. is that nii ? Yes. what is she saying?? Fay Howard, also ccTLD, also ex-pNC. thanks mark Ow! * paulds covers his ears. Can people in the room there hear the translator ok? I hope we're not all suffering with this. amadeu is now replying that person looks about 14 yrs old there isn't a translator on the audio only webcast... *** andyg has quit IRC (Connection Closed) *** andyg (andyg@stgo017.dialup.reuna.cl) Quit (Connection Closed) who is the bald gentleman ? There's one on the video webcast, but you can't understand her because of the high levels. That's Amadeu. Amadeu talks alot - just wish I could understand the translation, very frustrating Me too. Although it's probably just as well that I'm not getting what he's saying. ;) his hands say "I'm not happy work with me" now his hands say "I appeal to your sanity" I caught a snippet saying something about the commercial/noncommercial distinction being irrelevant. *** MichaelFroomkin has joined #ICANN-Santiago Welcome back Michael. welcome michael michael. Is that Dennis again? he said he typed a comment i am not too sure if he is no chat Michael: three times, the GA votes to request the BoD consider the IDNO petition tomorrow. *** anonymous has joined #ICANN-Santiago *** BretFausett has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer) *** BretFausett (BretFauset@adsl-63-194-18-210.dsl.lsan03.pacbell.net) Quit (Connection reset by peer) Who's that? hi jeff i'm not sure if that to me - if yes hello - is that 95k strong jeff you see? *clapclapclap!* joke Hear hear! Oh, joy. Esther again. Gah! Congestion. What's she saying? she likes consensus shes on now "process not as good as it should be" "wants to get something done" ok, got the feed back. k but get substance done -etc thanks Paul. :) is it really cold there orso? i love her - she's a good diplo yup Spending hours hashing things out in person isn't productive? I thought productivity was the argument for those in-person meetings?!? she is that. *** andyi has joined #ICANN-Santiago Welcome back, Andy. Phew. Now on-stage with power! michel u there ? But didn't Michael object to the content of the report? *** anonymous has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** anonymous (anonymous@stgo014.dialup.REUNA.CL) Quit (QUIT: ) RANDY BUSH NOW SPEAKING Make a note of the date: I agree with Randy Bush. ;) shock horror *** BretFausett has joined #ICANN-Santiago welcome back bret Geek Pride! :) *** RichardLindsay has quit IRC (QUIT: Leaving) *** RichardLindsay (richard@tom.interq.or.jp) Quit (QUIT: Leaving) thanks Is he wearinng a pink Buckyball? :) Geek Pride Fest: Boston, MA, October 1-3, 1999 :) I have audio of Randy Bush(?) but video of E.dyson...is that right? Michael: Nope. Some lucky person grabbed my video feed. I'm audio only. :-( Sounds like your streams are out of synch. Esther was 5 minutes ago. michael u there ? down to 24 now. get in why you can, bret. did u hear the reply to my question on ur recommendations Esther isn't staying at the main hotel as it doesn't have a swimming pool oh, *please*. You're kidding I hope, Andy. *** iceblue has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer) *** iceblue (iceblue@h24-66-253-254.xx.wave.shaw.ca) Quit (Connection reset by peer) Yes, my audio/vid synch seems off. didn't know that could be; time shows 2:16 live Did she have someone take out all the brown M&M's too? Jonathan reckoned that Michaels input in WG-A was included in the fianl report Second! would I kid you, Michael? I, a remote participant, second the motion. hah It is true that my main objections are listed as working items...to be referred to WIPO (which wasn't my suggestion...) I like having Jonathan as a parliamentarian he said they were accomidated - the word i believe Michael, ask that question via the web interface! Jon's doing good. agreed. Very talented in that regard please would u What question? His statement is true enough. The issue of who thinks next is minor compared to whether you implement flawed policies now. If we put a flawed process in place, we'll never be able to back it out and get a better solution. someone got out of bed in a huff today - bossing the chair. Heh! What's the urgency for uniformity? Why can't register.com draft and adopt their own policy? If mlangston were right we'd be using the NSI policy forever? Michael: We still are, aren't we? who is the lady Javier now speaking That was a rep from register.com. Don't know who she was Yes. We don't want them taking away peoples domain names, under the basis that they can give them back later when we get their stupid system replaced How do we get assurance they will put in the fixes if they deploy the beta now? THAT's the issue. he does not look like a gernalisimo Exactly. Well-said Michel, Andy. mason: He left the gold eapulets at home. :) There's Bill Semich in line. michael pls send ur questions thru the comments page sorry - who is this? i am not too sure they are reading it off here That is Jonathan Cohen ok i'm seeing a bearded guy? nope. Bearded guy is Javier. *** JohnWilbanks has joined #ICANN-Santiago no, George-Costanza guy right now. :) How about taking the WGA plan with a sunset provision? Your video feed's delayed. can we get froomkin's comments via the comment submission form? What's a sunset provision, Michael? over and out... how's scribing... oh. what coloured hair? It lapses by a date certain -- that's "sunset". sunset -- automatic expiration date oh hey JW. scribing et. al. is made difficult by the slow net... *** JohnWilbanks has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** JohnWilbanks (JohnWilban@stgo014.dialup.REUNA.CL) Quit (QUIT: ) Ah. ok the bald fat guy is johnathan cohen - friend of the tridel brothers That'd be ok, as long as it's unconditional. right But I won't stand for a sunset provision that says, "only if something else we agree on is ready to go". my connectio is too slow... I can't really type and watch Because it gives them an out. The guy who headed up the original committee should not head up the committee to review his own work. Bret: Very true. yes true... he'll just say that his work is excellent Are there really this few remote comments, or are they just not being addressed? some IP lawyer womn speaking right now few. check the web interface to the comments. IPC woman interim NC member It's Caroline Chiccoine. pNC IPC member. *** WilliamX has joined #ICANN-Santiago William! Welcome. Hi Mark Hi WilliamX! welcome wlliam Hello Andy and Sri, thank you *** WilliamX has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer) *** WilliamX (WilliamX@we-24-30-109-144.we.mediaone.net) Quit (Connection reset by peer) woah, dizzy camera *** WilliamX has joined #ICANN-Santiago *clapclapclap!* Sorry, I had a problem, its fixed now the chair is getting meaner - thats a good thing yah go Nii knock some heads :) Nii needs to be firm with this, or it'll get out of hand, like it did earlier with the IP lawyers. as quickly as possible before world realises whats being pulled on them ? alot of posing going on Froomkin's on-line question now on screen and being presented good. go Micheal !! I also asked about the sunset clause. cool * SrikanthNarra rings the bell * SrikanthNarra is a computer geek :-) heh. :) sorry - was trying to figure the chat interface 's ok help the lawyers day appeal hear hear. only if the suset clause is unconditional. congestion ! help update gah. congested again. argh net congestion - I lost cohen's comments... dang wow. we all did. Ben? Ben try the secondary server hosted from the berkman center net congestion in LA i will support tyhis motion if allows for immediate It's 5pm est - everyone got off work and started surfing... ah. here we go.. it seems to have less lag *** Display has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer) *** Display (Display@stgo011.dialup.reuna.cl) Quit (Connection reset by peer) someone didn't accept the amendment. Javier? can someone post what is being said ? Ben Javier's talking now. Wow. The translator's better! Not javier Thank you very much, whoever fixed it! thank you Translator is fixed! Great job. Young Peruvian guy from the NCDHNC? J Park? could be a bit lower - just a dash but acceptable :) It's no longer distorted. I don't care how loud it is, as long as we can understand her. i agree It's not just the registrar's comfort at stake here -- it's everyone who's involved, including all the domain name owners. Guy now talking is a registrar but I don't know who dont think he identified himself They want to table the motion for reconsideration with a sunset clause. must be register.com they are so out and out ICANN for some reason tabling is a standard parliamentary trick used to kill motions. Randy has temporarily withdrawn it so he can hone it better. Why is Johnathan presenting WG-B as well? Of course. here we go....wg-c Except those people WHO AREN'T THERE, Johnathan!!! Nice exclusion. That was wild - someone hit fast forward on the video... how can people who aren't there participate tomorrow, Johnathan? Why won't Theresa do D? *** FrancoisMenard has joined #ICANN-Santiago ? hello mark ask in comments Sri: We only get one per person, per topic. i see two comments of mine who is this gentleman ? Just stating what the page says. Someone reporting for WG-E. go ahead and get the comments in - maybe its one per person will be heard chile is EST ? EDT. Agenda sais ASO public forum, but is it what it is being discussed right now ? South America is more easterly than N.A. WG-D This is WG-E, andy. Oh! :) Doh! andy how are things looking ? Swinhart now on good. what is agenda for wg-e ? e = outreach speak up please! thanks bret WG-D now on there we go Theresa Swinehart. pNC member, chair of WG-D. but we haven't discussed those topics at all. shes right You guys have been quiet on the n-line comment page! there's nothing substantial to say. we're getting bored here on stage! Put a hat on. :) get naked? Do an Eric Cartman impersonation. are we the any other constituency now ? is Roberto come on yet? This seems like a very good summary of WG-D's muddle... Act like you see Jeff W in the back of the room surrounded by bodyguards. :) oooh. Javier Sola now presenting how many people in the room É atleast a honest update from spokesperson I thought so, too. A fair overview of the issues and problems in D. WG-C yo queri vere roberto This should be interesting, javier presenting his views on WG-C. I could do shadow puppets on the left hand video screen, if you like How far behind is my feed? I still have wg-d...i'll send this when it ends. Michael: About 30 seconds. c is going on now micheal lag is about fifteen seconds, sometimes a smuch as 20. rarely more, i don't think. Thank you.... this is an absolutely bias summary doh. rebuffering. What's sola saying? bs I'm so surprised. :) Approx 135 attendees at present is he wearing a leather jacket? for my own info, why is it that you guys are all rushing the small realvideo server rather than using the big one provided by REUNA of Santiago? looks like it. is the berkman feed better in some way? yes, less lagged don't quite understand how anyone could ethically argue against allowing non-profit registrars Ben: You know my reason. :) it's a plastic mac, I believe tomorrow, we're going to have lots more online participants ... and so their feed needs to be usable too. we trust it ben ours is less lagged? network topology yes ben (ours is accessible for those behind firewalls) ah, better net to ours. gotcha. too bad... was counting on theirs. Incidentally, if I log off, then log on, do I show as 2 users or one?...which server should I go to for video? network topology issues are causing a lot of rebuffering whats the exact agenda for C new gTLDs, sri if you log off, you lose your spot and someone else probably grabs it. Are we at full quota on all servers? thanks Wx want to be sure no more than 25 people are ever connected to the berkman video server at any time. he looks nervous lost He should be. full quota on this preferred server, while the two audio-only servers in cambridge surely have plenty of capacity, and i suspect the santiago servers (which apparently have slower net?) are well below peak (200 streams) also. do these gentleman get paid for this ? by whom ? Ben: Specificially in my case, I'd be just as happy with an audio-only feed. Sri: Some people are supported by their companies. mark, i can only reconfigure the server physically here. but now that i know what to do, i'll fix the servers back in cambridge... good for you for next time, i guess. we is the attempt to extend the term of this board I like the video - especially when you can see the facial gestures - like Twomey suffering. when is the attempt ? Yep. Thanks Ben. What? Where was Twomey? are the working groups permanent or just for this meeting, and how do I find the list of working groups ? he's not on now must be using Windows who is this man is this the berkman guy is this Andrew from ICANN? McLaughlin Andrew. That's McLaughlin? Yes, Andrew fine wine That's ICANN's website guy? are the working groups permanent or just for this meeting ? No, he's a lawyer - a good one from what I've seen. He is ICANN's Senior Advisor ah woo someone better remind him that they have been asked to consider IDNO tomorrow. they aren't permenant, only for the term of providing their reports how much maney have icann lawyers taken us for? www.dnso.org has info on the workgroups cha-ching! wx - they are saying sept 15 is the final date for constituency Oh, joy. thats out of context I would have to say is that a good or bad thing i think its only one question per person - can u ask the comment the bylaws don't place any limitations on new constituency development someone put a question up! I think this is in regard to the provisionally recognized ones only he says they will change bylaws that seems to be his focus lets ask to be sure wx I just submitted that reminder to him that the GA has asked the board to consider IDNO tomorrow. He neglected to include that in the constituency summary there. he is asking for questions now wx want to go for it ? asking them now. thanks :) So wait...he didn't bother to sit through the rest of the meeting? He has confirmed that there are ICANN board members in the audience who are now aware that the GA wants themn to consiedr the IDNO petition tomorrow I hat epeople who show up for their presentation and then leave. It implies contempt. Mark-> There are other mtgs going on concurrently Andy: I think that request needs to be made as publically as possible, and that they get reminded of it. Jon: Ah. thanks. i agree who is the final authority on agenda ? Dennis is tenacious, isn't he? ;) I would suspect that Joop will be on the case to ensure it gets heard tomorrow! yup Dennis is VERY good. Joop now speaking Dennis gets my vote for the ICANN Board. I hope both Joop and andy are there, along with as many other supporters as can be fit into the room. Me too. Dennis is very good. I'm looking for my bells right now Woo! Go Joop! feh, I think I'm about 15 seconds lagged go joop who is talking ? Joop's asking McLaughlin about the timeframe for constituency recognition, and the NCDNHC and IDNO's latecoming to the process. Dennis again someone tell me when joop is on screen - never seen him before despite working with him Go Dennis go! I only met him when he turned up to share my hotel room. He doesn't snore, luckily! He's very good at this. ..lol.. hah heh! lots of people turning up suddenly andy is that our dennis or someone else Dennis, chairman of ccTLD. Irish TLD kewl the lawyers again NO. The ccTLD voted to support IDNO in getting recognition from ICANN in their meeting yesterday kathy ? what about the protection of due process rights wx - ask it on-line! pls * paulds wonders how much longer the mtg will go... I've lost my feed I don't understand this revision of R.Bush's motion. A committee alone is not of much value, is it? I get the horrible feeling the room is filling with lawyers. I think another plane-load just landed. They should have stopped them at the border! I am asking for ur sake if i have ur permission wx ? I can't hear anything go ahead I might have to reboot this darn computer done .ca? who is this person on display (politely, the black guy) had to work. What'd I miss? Nii Qaynor, the mtg chair Francois: That's Nii Quaynor. Nii is from ?? someone put in revised notion mark Joop currently in discussion with Esther and another ICANN board member (I think he is, anyway) Without a sunset clause? andy: Any idea about what? yes *sigh* Nope, sorry Nii is from ? with clear definition of squatting, protection of reverse hicjacking etc not too acurate update but had four ammendments Does anyone know why no one seems worried about the anti-trust issue on UDPs? Nii is from the ccTLD constituency, I forget the ccTLD he represents however lets leave it Michael thats our final and possibly only protection ? Aha - they "recommend" - that takes ICANN off the legal hook? hmm..will it get them off ? Peter Dengate-Thrush has just arrived so who gets to be on the committee? (I asked online, don't know if it'll get addressed) *** nancyfoti has joined #ICANN-Santiago nice one mark All the GAC guys have shown up. I will see if I can find the India reps for you, Sri means we will filter more people thanks andy Mark-> Motion contemplates that ICANN bd will select commiteemembers. Andy: See if you can find out what Joop was up to w/Esther. Aigh! Jon: No way! Did that motion pass?!? It's under discussion as we type. Geez! Ken Stubbs now speaking Communicate our votes to the room. Note that "top level" committees are all picked that way. what are your votes? so, we accept WG-A, and the NC picks the people who decide any issues srrounding it. lagged here... :/ why act ? What's the immediacy? I.e., this is the final attempt to shut up dissenters on WG-A's report. I am willing to be on this committee. I'm also willing NOT to be on it :> ok sound is back I'm back up to speed :) who is this person A lawyer. You can tell. :) "Are you speaking in support of the motion?" This isn't a formal debate. Ken stubbs? WAS KEN STUBBS, THEN AMADEU The blurry person was Ken, yes. The non"are you speaking in support?" person. what was he saying for or against ? Ken wants something in place now. Amadeu has a point.... That was the .md guy asking for confirmation that this stuff is only for gTLD's I notice people are leaving. ok..they are looking for escape route :) I would restrict it even further, until WG-C makes its proposals, to com/net/org only i agree me too. *** JoshElliott has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** JoshElliott (JoshElliot@icann1.isi.edu) Quit (QUIT: ) Adjourned for 45 minutes b4 GAC report actually if we can restrict to .com and test it out there that would be good too well Works for me. what time is it there ? I don't see any way to split the way we deal with those three domains argh can we floor that motion ? Ben, you there? they are in effect identical *** JoshElliott has joined #ICANN-Santiago must go. gf obligations. what is this .nd thing ? a new ccTLD opened up for worldwide business ? ben is busy that way atleast some IDNOers will be spared being experimental subjects Again, I must go off line for a while; anything major, someone email me please.... give 'em appropriate hell, all. Bye Paul OK Michael, will do joop has disappeared - I'll see if I can get him on here for a second *** paulds has quit IRC (QUIT: gf) *** paulds (paulds@PROZAC.BU.EDU) Quit (QUIT: gf) Francois: .md. Being marketed to medical doctors. hmm wx, mark, andy andy: ieeee! Esther's kidnapped him! :) pls stay on lol *** MichaelFroomkin has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** MichaelFroomkin (MichaelFro@g382-1.law.MIAMI.edu) Quit (QUIT: ) lets summarize the meet for update to members and plan for tommorow maybe Sri! *** HilaryKarls has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** HilaryKarls (HilaryKarl@pool-209-138-193-131.nwrk.grid.net) Quit (QUIT: ) *** FrancoisMenard has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer) *** FrancoisMenard (FrancoisMe@132.210.101.110) Quit (Connection reset by peer) *** fmenard has joined #ICANN-Santiago pls : ) Hang about here, everyone, I'll get Joop kewl cool. we can have our first online meet what country is md gac! gacgacgac! gacgac! gac! I'm here Francois: I forgot. let me check my notes and get an answer for that one is there anything in the works to prevent the marketing of ccTLDs to international organizations ? I hope not I would oppose any such restriction, it would be a violation of anti-competitive laws ccTLDs are turning into a farce .... feels like I want to conquer an island and start a new country wx - can u briefly summarize for our members progress so far :) recruiting an army yet? hey which meeting is this ? Modolva is .md twomey - our friend Sri : I don't think I can at the moment, maybe later, I cannot miss this part, I have a real vested interest in this part bang the gavel no probs wx he's all alone up there joop here joop how is the progress does it look good ? twomey speaking now that man should appologize to the world for treatening it we have done well today s best as we could he is from australia ? yes we got the non commercila peo[pe to support us and we got the GA behind us. as always Joop ! as always !! Esther is conferring with Joe Sims , how to handle it tomorrow. sorry, had to work. *** Dschutt has quit IRC (Connection Closed) *** Dschutt (David@2.specoinc.enterconnect.net) Quit (Connection Closed) Si's posting was well taken and Bradley's too. (or was it Mark?) *** nancyfoti has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** nancyfoti (nancyfoti@pound-9432.student.harvard.edu) Quit (QUIT: ) i posted twise which one ? is bradley here at the moment? Can you follow twomey at the same time? twomey looks nervous too. look tight - no relaxed. Joop: We have the ccTLD support as well, don't we? Let me listen and observe closely for a while. This stuff may be more criticAL THAN EVEN THE DNSO. this is extreme OVER AND OUT this is very very extreme I'm listening as well this must be opposed with everything we have wx summarize fast what is he proposing ? they must be stopped WWE SHOULD TRY TO GET IN FIRST, BEFORE WE SHOW OUR HAND TOO MUCH. *** NickPatience has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** NickPatience (NickPatien@38.150.19.155) Quit (QUIT: ) good luck ! tks *** hilarykarls has joined #ICANN-Santiago the chinese are not yet full members are they - they are only their to watch Marks question china is in Yes, the ccTYLD,s en block raised their hands for us. good. what'd he say? I lost it. good one "I'd like to know..."? congestion he is questioning why the meetings are still closed from .md *** JonZittrain has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer) *** JonZittrain (JonZittrai@stgo016.dialup.reuna.cl) Quit (Connection reset by peer) i lost the sound *** andyi has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer) *** andyi (andyg@stgo017.dialup.REUNA.CL) Quit (Connection reset by peer) I lost the whole thing. damned Still can't connect. me too who is the one answering and what is the full statement i just got in there it goes something like it still will be a bit like that *** MichaelFroomkin has joined #ICANN-Santiago michael welcome .md asked about whey icann is still meeting in secret not too sure about reply what was the response? I still can't reach the server. something like it still needs to like that a bit i think he is hinting on operational reasons grr. and comparing to countries need to part secrecy to functioning on development of similar policy PING? PONG! ah. here we go. are u guys on with video or do i keep typing responses who is the australian on the mike ? His he from GAC ? What does it stand for and what is the website ? errr... *** edelman has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer) *** edelman (edelman@stgo012.dialup.reuna.cl) Quit (Connection reset by peer) government advisory committee of ICANN i am getting the sound the video frozen I still can't get anything. talking on some member asking about memo implication for both tld and cctld working well from here at the University of Sherbrooke, QC CAN thearse from citizen something question is :- how can advisory committe be a open one and yet citizens be denied participate in it damn. I wish I could hear this. government secrecy is bad they need some means of being held accountable for their comments and votes on this committee after all, they represent our governments hey! got it, finally. I already submitted a comment to him, can someone else make that point perhaps? if govts are going to get together and take about issues they need some secrecy as to transperancy we are putting agenda and points on website secrecy? lost it again. I don't agree with that and they are putting country representatives details on website for citizens to participate or contact lost it what web site net suddenly got very bad. *** andyg has joined #ICANN-Santiago good comment wx *** NickPatience has joined #ICANN-Santiago I missed a whole pile of comments just now. i think Joop froze my IRC client somehow! *sigh* looks like I'm missing the whole thing. not ICANN meeting in secret, this is GAC we're doing now. i lost the connect too got it I think IRC dropped out as well hi andy I can't connect to the site anymore. hi andy *** edelman has joined #ICANN-Santiago damn lost it again a ccTLD member wants to know if the GAC Is considering adding more than the 13 contries already represented hello Ben can some one type the question hi ben. hi ben is the server overloaded? *** NickPatience has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer) *** NickPatience (NickPatien@38.150.19.155) Quit (Connection reset by peer) - That was Nigel? from .gg got it I missed who it was. current questin guy had the mic about a metre away, stuff all people heard the question lost our net, sorry he suggested consideration of extra dimensions of copyright wipo by cctld I still have everything... Once again the audio is waaay ahead of the video? distinction between open and closed ccTLD out come he says outcome and agenda 1. dispute resolution wx's question about to bew read out 2. clarification what is the URL to GAC ? Is there a link off the ICANN site ? what's the question? it hidden but somewhere on icann regarding govt control of ccTLD's? *** anonymous has joined #ICANN-Santiago I think the network is revolting against Twomey and refusing to carry his image. :) walsh's message is now on screeb screen wx's question up on the main vid screen right now would reduce net pollution mark :) thanx ben net is horible. sorry guys keep up the good work Ben! what is the URL to GAC and is there a link on the ICANN site ? doing a great job, Ben. looks great from here You're doing wonderfully ben, don't worry http://www.icann.org/governmental-com.html i just gave Ben a pat on the back for everyone here *** anonymous has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** anonymous (anonymous@208.197.234.122) Quit (QUIT: ) thanks The net's just refusing to route Twomey-tainted packets. lol who exactly is Twomey? There seems to be a big delay on the link suddenly Avile politician from .au. Twomey is evil *** MichaelFroomkin has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** MichaelFroomkin (MichaelFro@129.171.196.230) Quit (QUIT: ) what did he do? (I'm new here...) He spends his spare time trying to come up with a way to have an online version of book-burnings. well said langston oh... sounds pretty evil... there are a lot more like him in AU, they just don't have the constitutional protections we have here in the US to protect themselves against his type Wasn't Twomey responsible for the .au net censorship bill? we need to start a drive to mail Twomey leftovers - collect postage translation is much better... who is speaking? yes, this translation is quite good, isn't it. didn't catch his name. wonderful did not know it was translation. much better where's he from? does anyone know? more importantly, what's he saying? sorry, I don't recognize him but he is making several very good points talking about openness... true the translator is doing an excellent job amazing... I know how difficult good translation is... *** EdmonChung has joined #ICANN-Santiago "we are trying to find more ways of being open" translation "We are trying to find a way to make it appear we are being more open and still be able to be unaccountable for our own actions and statements" An Australian government official with responsibility for information economy issues, Dr. Twomey will lead the committee charged with providing advice and counsel to ICANN on a wide-range of government-related matters. press releases - hmm hmm indeed ...and he'll censor all net traffic into and out of Australia. what does he have against free speach? And free access? they don't have a clue - he knows whats coming hmm I'm 10ft away from him. Got a water pistol? jeff: im enjoying this. very tasty chap filled with diasppearing ink? the minister is angry - ask him chinas conditions what's going on? wx's question now being dealt with what's his question? very nice no shortness of time? well said mark its on comments page where's the comments page? can someone point out that they have legilative NOT executive authority over ccTLDs what law - what principle and that this difference needs to be pointed out that they are asserting executive control and using legislative control law to justify it *** edelman has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer) *** edelman (edelman@stgo012.dialup.reuna.cl) Quit (Connection reset by peer) is china there as a observer or participant *** edelman has joined #ICANN-Santiago the chinese position is very important sri, ask that on-line quickly what exactly is china's position? I'm confused... i jsut did researching methods of using chinese characters in tld and branching off the root servers. i've lost video and audio - opps there it goes is that joop? wx what do u say to that ? I've yet to have it Mason. Be thankful. :) yep it was joop, but I didn't understand his question what effect would that have on the chinese gov't attempts to crush democratic dissidants who are using the internet? Sri : I made my comments above i've had very few problems. sorry got it they most certianly have legislative control no one would deny that that exists whether we acknowledge it or not but they are asserting executive control they could censor the net for their citizens overnight and using the precept of legislative control to justify it *** mlangston has quit IRC (QUIT: Leaving) *** mlangston (bofh@gecko.roadtoad.net) Quit (QUIT: Leaving) that all for today - yes? ok, I'm afraid at this point, I am going to have to return to some work *** baptista has quit IRC (QUIT: baptista has no reason) *** baptista (baptista@cgowave-40-147.cgocable.net) Quit (QUIT: baptista has no reason) my ability to participate today is limited another short intermission? enjoy working... I may be in and out no Nii back in the seat how long will this go on ? Has to finish by 7pm though k where is joop ? are we on strong wicket for tommorow ? he's got the right idea - cocktails is that the end of it or do we hang around ? I believe there are like half an hour left we're continuing the DNSO meeting what about the Ga that was postphoned ? well the main show - Dr. Twomey is over. but the transmission only lasts until 7 lets just subsontract all of this to the japanease. massive meetings happening out the back between Jonathan Cohen and the IP Lawyer shark-fest *** BretFausett has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** BretFausett (BretFauset@adsl-63-194-18-210.dsl.lsan03.pacbell.net) Quit (QUIT: ) *** BretFausett has joined #ICANN-Santiago Will someone please give ben a back rub when this is over? the lawyers - watch out for the lawyers - it's only a game that pays well he might need it heh all the people from the Berkman Center that have worked on this deserve a big thanks Applause in their general direction I draw the line at giving Ben _any_ sort of rub their work can be held up as an example to others * WilliamX laughs at andy I second it - if there is one good thing abut the whole thing give him a woman. *** teagram has joined #ICANN-Santiago its Berkman center I' could find some very nice girls here and ask them if they could give Ben AND ME rubs! *** edelman has quit IRC (Connection reset by peer) *** edelman (edelman@stgo012.dialup.reuna.cl) Quit (Connection reset by peer) what ask - pay them 20 dollars - they'll be bens best friends for the night - boy desearves it *** teagram has left #ICANN-Santiago The IDNO budget doesn't cover that sort of thing! More's the pity! lol um... please forget... well that. what - something must be done about that - a flexible entertainment budget in the right place can be a hole in one - pardone the pun ok, come on, thats enough :) fellas lets watch the floor just forget it. *** RobinNixon has joined #ICANN-Santiago sounds good to me my video feed is black so is ours - but everyone is now on the second drinks - so it's looking better you guys still here? yep andy how do we look for tommorow ? is joop around ? what meetings are on tap for tomorrow? *** andyg has left #ICANN-Santiago *** RussSmith has joined #ICANN-Santiago remember the IRC server should remain up, if anyone wants to possibly meet later today we are not restricted to only those times that the meetings are going on wx do u want to discuss his meet ? *** edelman has joined #ICANN-Santiago sorry, sri, I'm not sure I understand what you are asking about just to chat about where we stand if any thing needs to done on our part or update members I'd like to stay and chat randomly a bit wx ? I've only been able to be here for a small part of it, I'd probably feel more comfortable if someone who was here for more of the meetings did that,a nd who has had more contact with andy and joop about their progress i get it - lets hope we can get them back fmenard : I hope I will be here off and on throughout the evening (its 3:49pm here) unlike the wipo proposals ? did u hear that ? where is here? * RussSmith is really very bored. on IRC *** RobinNixon has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** RobinNixon (RobinNixon@nixon-db.dsl.clubnet.net) Quit (QUIT: ) where is IRC? that is this chat system Internet Relay Chat thanx if the berkman center web client doesn't stay up, you can use the one I am hosting at DNSPolicy.com ( http://www.dnspolicy.com/santiagochat.html ) it will come to the same server and channel as you are in right now who is speaking? was speaking dennis i believe amadeu now *** RussSmith has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** RussSmith (RussSmith@cj52269-a.alex1.va.home.com) Quit (QUIT: ) are you watching the video feed hilarykarls yes I've been watching off and on since the beginning of the DNSO meeting this is the direct URL if you have problems pnm://200.28.16.28/live/icann-live-082499-2.rm pnm://200.28.16.28/live/icann-live-082499-2.rm i think - thats what weve been watching who is this person? yes, mason, that's right. very nice ben - you get a cookie tonight actually i was thinking of some steak :) my mom is making me one right now... ..lol..ben a meat and patatoes man. i like here I'd like a good fruit salad this woman is making her points very very well very direct i like direct people - time savers avery just lost the case against a individual domain name owner ! who is this woman? yep, I have the news article, will be up on dnspolicy.com as soon as this is over :) my connection just went... Is that normal? I vote for this as well, people should not be there for 3 years while ramp-up of ICANN ** clap clap * some times - just open real video and load the new url. *** andyg has joined #ICANN-Santiago "I vote for this as well, no mandate for 3 years while ramp up of ICANN" who was that talking to ben about removing the brackets? *** EdmonChung has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** EdmonChung (EdmonChung@HSE-TOR-ppp24825.sympatico.ca) Quit (QUIT: ) (just trying to get names straight) The Parliamentarian for the session they have gone past 7 My link dropped out sorry Motion carried! so I'm on about a 90 second delay then it looks like so the terms are now limited to 1 year ? andy reported it carried about 90 seconds before I saw it sri : thats just a recommendation to the board yup no limits i understand - they want to be paid for all this work got my video back. Thanx Mason thanks wx - u, andy and others have been very kind walking me thru thanks from me too its a pleasure, sri hilary/mason which constituency u from ? at the moment my own. I's a high school student i'm independent - support joop wow thats good from nz ? hilary : thats great, I hope you can stay involved I hope so too, but I'm facing the college process we need more like him. their the one's who are going to get this planet amen this motion should be tabled Yeah Z! who made the choice to hold the meeting in Chile ? Ben, is McLaughlin around there? ICANN board Unilatelrally ? its their decision who is the gentleman talking ? is it a recommendation too ? i'm very pleased were still getting real video - this is a very interesting part of the process - all the pr crew has left - the rest is raw they have a mandate however to have meetings in diverse geographical locations josh - no, andrew stepped away, sorry. Actually, is was a recommendation from ICANN staff, agreed to by the ICANN board Thanks, Ben. Do you know about the status of the private discussions between DOC and ICANN and NSI on the contract for the protocol software of NSI ? oh, wait, i see andrew. let me get him. Nothing new on the negotiations Thanks, Ben. it's getting fruity - people are fizing its time to wrap up for the evening i think I think they're out of time for the room anyway I think fatigue is setting in they should go all night - like a real parliament whats agenda for tommorow ? that's what they will become mason : but only professional sharks..I mean politicians, could handle that :) If we went all nght, we'd miss the cocktail evening! i lost the connection of believe me - at 95k anything can happen. i disappointed jeffw never showed. here i was all calmed down have taken afternoon tea early *** hilarykarls has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** hilarykarls (hilarykarl@pool-207-205-160-122.nwrk.grid.net) Quit (QUIT: ) lol it's all falling to pieces here, guys! wx andy wat are the important times we need to be on ? andy : can someone move that this motion be limited to com/net/org until WG-C gets a chance to complete its work isnert language to that effect so that there is no room for misinterpretation bung it on the on-line comments page - easier than me trying to get it out here. done i am headed out mates seeya sri! THanks for your help ok sri bye catch you later or tomorrow ben is there any chance of getting that comment I made before any vote? is charlee needee there - the berkman chap the link has crapped out - they can't get to it pleasure is mine mates..give me holler on email if you want me online stop that vote! :) nite ! night sri *** MikkiBarry has joined #ICANN-Santiago *** SrikanthNarra has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** SrikanthNarra (SrikanthNa@talus.net) Quit (QUIT: ) Welcome Mikki it's all over! hi william, hi everyone I can see that very disappointing it's all over? just in time for me to get here? what happened? it all fell to shit at the end Soemthing screwy went on regarding the WG-A proposal thats what i would call good legal planning. please watch the profanity *sigh* I've been working on the answers to congress all day...just now got here ok, now random chatting time ? yeah they waited until the end when fatigue was setting in and the issue didn't get the fleshing out it deserved seems to have been the modus operandi yep. played in the fact that the room had to be emptied soon well, if someone has a good summary, I'm sure Congress will be interested. I'll include with the information they asked from me :-) the best time to have a trail is friday afternoon - every just worth his salt wants out. good legal planning. wheres our covert operations? *** BretFausett has quit IRC (Connection Closed) *** BretFausett (BretFauset@adsl-63-194-18-210.dsl.lsan03.pacbell.net) Quit (Connection Closed) William, you have a substantive real-time comment asking under which authority can ICANN assert control over ccTLDs that were already delegated Everyone must have been tired - they have been meeting since early this morning, collectively or in their groups is the online streaming coverage terminated at this point? looks like it Probably - no reason to continue yep THey dropped the vid and the link has come back up to speed I am wondering why you think that it is positive to ccTLD's being use for purposes that they are not intended to ... isin't it what gTLDs are supposed to be used for ? did anything good happen about the idno? Mikki, I am sure there will be some posts on the ICANN or DNSO website in the next couple of days which will summarize what went on today fmenard: I never said that, and again, that is presupposing what the purpose of them was likely so josh :-) I was just lazy and wanted the down and dirty now :-) Mikki : my understanding is that the GA seems to have come to support the recognition of the IDNO as did the NCDNHC not surprised about the NCDNHC's support I believe the DNSO recommended to the ICANN board to putthe IDNO proposal on the agenda for Thursday and that seemed to be strong support within a couple of the other constituencies, including the ccTLD constituency well that sounds really good. hopefully it will go appropriately That is, Thursday's Board meeting but that is just the feeling I get from Andy and Joop's comments oh, the closed board meeting? :-) unfortunately work kept me away from the early portions of the proceedings Well, doesn't the process by which ccTLDs are allocated demonstrates that it isin't appropriate to use ccTLD's as gTLDs ? me too I personally think that ccTLDs should be decided by the individual governments involved fmenard : by what process are you referring to? if the individual government (not the GAC mind you) believes that it should be used as a pseudo gtld, so be it Mikki : they have legislative control under international law to do that Andy and Joop shuttign down now, for a wee rest but I would strongly oppose them asserting executive control night kids...well done :-) without legislative authority Joop will be clearing his email tonite, to get all up to date, then we'll post something to the SC night andy seeya guys and Joop CCTLDs are allocated via the procedures established in RFC1591 and now ICP-1 excellent...you guys shoudl go sleep give Ben a pat on the back *** andyg has quit IRC (QUIT: smIRCle - my definition of IRC. http://smircle.home.pages.de) *** andyg (andyg@stgo017.dialup.REUNA.CL) Quit (QUIT: smIRCle - my definition of IRC. http://smircle.home.pages.de) how is ISO3166 updated ? by the International Standards Organization Session Start: Tue Aug 24 19:29:47 1999 The ISO 3166 Maintenance Agency reviews requests, and updates the list via their own procedures. the ISO-3166 list is used for a variety of purposes Session Close: Tue Aug 24 19:30:00 1999 I'm going to leave as well...I have a ton more work to do on these answers Yeah, but lets say I conquer some small island and claim to be a country called tazmania and I want .tm ok, Mikki, perhaps I will see you here tomorrow? thanks for the updates...I'll likely be back tomorrow yes, hopefully so bye bye *** MikkiBarry has quit IRC (QUIT: ) *** MikkiBarry (MikkiBarry@super.ego.org) Quit (QUIT: ) fmenard : I suspect the US Marines would probably oust you before it got that far :) does it make sense ? No ... so I think that having ccTLDs is meaningless ... in light that only gTLDs could do the job you know how they like to interfere :) The Maintenance Agency allocates the codes. You don't get to choose which code you like. (by the way, .tm is already allocated to Turkmenistan) so for example, ccTLD .ca, and I register .can as a gTLD, then is the government of Canada going to go after me ? at this point the discussion gets too theoretical for me :) and I do have to return to work, I have a customer project I need to complete this evening Nigh, Mr. X I'll leave this window open (and logging) and will be back to chat periodically throughout the evening Josh: is there any thing that would prevent .can from being used as a substitute for .ca ?